If you don’t mind, I would like to leave for a moment the devlopment behind, and ask a question: what do you think about netbooks and development?
I mean, I would like to buy a netbook, and I’ve already found and affordable one, and I’m going to buy it for carrying it around at the university and in conferences, so I can access the Web, chats and things like that with a light instrument; what I’m asking is: for your experience, how is using a netbook in events like hackmeetings or development meetings, for example like the “KDE projectname sprint” ones?
I have already experienced programming on an Atom (I have an eeebox at home, and I had to use it for a couple of weeks while waiting for my new notebook), and of course I had been able to develop some code without much fuss, yes I had to wait some time while recompiling code, but not that much in the end, so is it worth bringing a netbook to that kind of meeting?
The positive aspect is that a netbook is light in dimensions and weight, and I can survive on a 10″ screen for a few days (I had a friend who survived on a 7″ screen for a year!), and I can bring it with me every time (I don’t want to leave a computer in a hotel room, for example…).
Please, comment and tell your opinion! 🙂
Syvo3 
Hi, I’ve recently bought a netbook just for giving talks and classes. KDE 4 runs quite performatic in ACER positive one and even for small development talks it’s been useful. Of course, you don’t want to use it to compile all kdelibs, etc, but if you have some time to dispend in an initial compilation of smaller projects you can easily survive in a developer sprint.
Imo the only reason one would buy a netbook and consider using it for development is his budget.
– netbooks are considerably slower, though if you can put 3-4 Gig of ram into it and have an SSD, it could potentially even be a pretty fast devel machine. But then again: SSDs and compiling, i.e. lots of disk access might lead to a (highly?) reduced lifetime for the SSD…
– the keyboard is much smaller, hence slower typing
– less screen real-estate, which means (for me) less productivity
I’d never want to exchange my notebook with a netbook
Well make sure you get a 10in netbook. Hopefully that goes without saying. It mostly negates Milian’s point on small keyboard size.
Anyways having such a light netbook is really quite different then a bulky notebook. You can carry with you to the conference and then not have to worry about dropping it off when you go to a bar afterwards. I take it when I bike downtown to the library, even though I’m not sure I’ll actually use it.
And yea, its fine for development. I even compiled the kernel on my eeepc 1005ha at an airport. 🙂 You don’t need 4 gigs of ram and an SSD to develop. The 1 gig of ram and normal hard drive of the 1005ha works fine.
Make sure you get a cute purse, I mean, laptop bag for it or else you lose some of its mobility. 😉
The #1 thing for me is the keyboard, get one you like! some people can live with pressing Fn+arrow for pageup (EEE), other’s can’t (samsung). Almost all netbooks can take 2G Ram, a cheap upgrade which is worth it.
For development I guess you want a hdd for the space, but maybe you can get away with the eee 40G ssd? I am not that worried about ssd lifetime, mount /tmp and /var/tmp as tmpfs and if you want to be reaaaally sure, use ext2 for /
As for the compilation time, maybe you can use the netbook as a frontend to a fast machine with NX? Or hacksprints should maybe start featuring compilation clusters (icecream) 🙂
You should also have a look at what were once called “subnotebooks”, i.e. very lightweight 12″ laptops, for example the Thinkpad X200{s}. Take both kinds of laptops into your hand, type on them, then decide.
If you’re in no rush I’d wait for the new new dual core atoms and/or the ones coming out with Nvidia graphics. These enhancements could be a game changer performance wise.
Of course if you’re in a rush and only note taking and web browsing the existing configurations will suffice.
PS – do you feel comfortable with the smaller keyboard?
a coworker of mine has a x200s. You can’t hold it in the palm of your hand, its still more of a notebook then a netbook (in both size and price). Obviously its much more powerful, but at the price of a x200s you can get a desktop that is /way/ more powerful so it sill doesn’t make sense to use it as your primary machine, in the same way you wouldn’t want an eeepc to be your primary machine. So desktops still have their place. 🙂
If money is no object (eg someone else is buying) then a x200s probably isn’t a bad idea. 🙂
@Bill the 10in netbooks have 92% sized keyboards, you really can’t tell. 🙂
“some people can live with pressing Fn+arrow for pageup (EEE), other’s can’t (samsung).” -Vespas
Well, the EeePC does not have bad the Fn+Arrow functions at all. The FN button is next on the right of up arrow. Shift is left on the up arrow. To press “page up” takes just one press with one finger (press middle of both keys.) With two, both are easyli done. Same way with Home and End keys. It is same as pressing typical keyboard.
I’m currently writing from tokamak3. I;m using my eee for development here since it is the only laptop I have (I don’t like laptops)
It is kinda OK to work on it… even compiling kdelibs didn’t take that much time.
My main problem is that I’m used to a real keyboard, so even normal laptops annoy me.
If you’re used to Vim+Konsole – you’ll have enough space…
Cheers!
I wouldn’t pay more than 200$/€ for an atom based laptop. Got my aspire one a110 plus 1GB additional RAM for that amount. Also I wouldn’t get one with a HDD, I already dropped mine several times so an SSD is really good for not having to care too much for such a portable machine. For developing I use an external HDD, doing huge compilations on my desktop and only updating compilations on the a110 on the go. An NX connection to your desktop is helpful as well in case you keep that running.
I agree with mutlu – take a look at sub notebooks. They are more expensive but do cary quite a bit more power in the same package as a netbook. Eg I replaced my Acer Aspire One with a sony Vaio. The vaio has the exact same size, weight and battery life but caries a 1.2 ghz C2D and 11″ 1366×768 screen (A vgn-TZ series). And was EUR 1000…
The acer timeline series and comparable laptops are also a lot easier to carry yet nice to work on. And a bit cheaper than the X200/X300/Vaio’s. The X4500 video is also an advantage over the gma950…
Thank you for your answers so far!
I’m looking to the Asus 1005HA, which I found at a reasonable price and it seems a good compromise between a few parameters; the only thing that I don’t like so much is the hdd, I’d prefer an SSD one, but well I can’t have everything!
And I too started a kdelibs recompilation on the eeebox, but I have to admit that I stopped it a few minutes later, it was really slow… of course, it wasn’t a necessary recompilation at that time 🙂
I think the real problem is the screen resoultion. I mean what can you actually display on 1024×600? I had an 1400×1050 14″ display and switched to a news Thinpad SL300 with 1280×800.
I still miss those 250 pixel in vertical screen size. At least when I surf through the web. In development it’s ok…
I don’t see the point making 16:9 displays for computers. I mean most people do actually work on a computer, not watching movies…
But thats a different story.
@Frank: I don’t think that lack of 4:3 display is a problem, at least on development IDEs like Eclipse you can put any view on a lateral pane instead of the bottom one, so it’s not a big problem for me… 🙂
@Siv: In using an IDE I agree with you, but when you read some documentation or use a web page or even skimming through code, I want to have maximum vertical space for this.
Last I talked with somebody on this and we agreed, than an Netbook with an rotatable 16:10 would be nice for these tasks 😉
I bought a Samsung NC20 a couple months ago to replace my mostly dead Acer 15″. And I’ve got to say it’s great. Specs:
* VIA Nano CPU (~Intel Atom)
* 1Gb RAM (upgraded to 2Gb, recommended)
* 1280×800 screen.
* normal size good quality keyboard.
* 120Gb HHD.
* 1.5 kg (I think)
* good build quality.
* good battery. (~4 hours)
* 450 euro.
It is either a big netbook or a cheap low power ultraportable. Either way, it hits a great combination of features for the price.
I had this at GCDS and have had no trouble. It might take bit longer, but hey, we had this kind of power on the desktop a few years back and we survived. Most of the time you don’t recompile KDE during development, just what you changed. Plenty fast enough.
If you haven’t committed to a model yet, I would recommend that you wait a little bit — depending on what your price range for such a product is.
Take a look at the following link: http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/news/2009/09/unlaunched-atom-smasher-shows-up-in-samsung-x-series-laptops.ars
Keep in mind though, that the pricing information included in that article may not entirely be correct, and if you delve into the comments on that page, you’ll see links to currently-available affordable models that you may want to consider as well.
Buying a netbook at this point in time, given their form factor, screen resolution, processing power, etc. might not be a satisfying decision. They’re fine to do development on, but they are somewhat underpowered for compilation (which takes a long time as it is).
Depending on how much money you want to sink into it, I think the best options are: A Core 2 Duo ULV processor (more expensive, not out yet), or an existing solution with a Core 2 Solo ULV processor. They provide more processing power and better battery life than their Atom brethren, and are just more versatile machines overall. Their form factors typically aren’t quite as small as a netbook; but I think they can commonly be found in at least the 13″ range. I personally can’t stand less than 12″.
I think the new upcoming round of Core 2 Duo ULVs is going to be available in smaller (netbook-like) form factors as well, for those that need the portability.
Good luck with your decision.
Hey Siv! I’ve been using an Eee 1005HA for the last couple of weeks and I am still trying to sort through my feelings about it. I really need to sit down and cogitate my feelings into words and blog about it (maybe this weekend?). But anyway, aside from some wifi network driver issues that I think I’ve now beaten into submission, I’m pretty darned happy with the 1005HA. The battery life is one of the huge draws for me. The screen size is a bit of a bummer, since you can only really view one application at a time (which is very different than I’m used to working on my 1680×1050 work laptop resolution) but it’s really not all that bad. The keyboard is smaller than a normal laptop keyboard but at 92%, it’s not all that horrible. I think what bothers me more is the lack of power. Playing the occasional flash video on YouTube (or the new Assassin’s Creed II trailer, for instance) is downright painful and I can’t figure out how to get it to not suck. Compiling kernel modules (like the compat-wireless modules to get ath9k working with the Atheros wifi chip in this thing) is slower than a normal laptop, but not really all that bad. And I can say that spending $235 for this thing really felt like it was worth it. I’m a cheapskate so anything more than $300 or so feels like it should be such an awesome laptop that I absolutely love it. $235 is right in that sweet spot where if I don’t absolutely fall in love with it and just use it as a “take anywhere” device, I don’t feel bad about it. I can say, though, that I do not like having to use a touchpad as my primary mouse device. I’ve been using lenovo thinkpads for so long that I am totally addicted to the little “nipple” mouse in the middle of the keyboard. This one I did not expect to matter to me, but it really has. I’m getting used to the touchpad on the 1005HA, but I still wish I would have thought about it first and I probably would have bought a Lenovo idea-pad or something.
Anyway, hope this helps even a little. =:)
@Jason: I have my 1005HA for the last couple of weeks, too (yes, in the end I have bought it), and I haven’t used it a lot, probably I will start “testing” it thoroughly from the next week, when I will start my university courses.
Anyway, for now I like almost any of it: the video resolution of course is a bit more limitating than on my work laptop, but for now I have almost only used a web browser, and if you put it fullscreen it’s not that bad; I have also compiled a couple of source packages, but it went fine and not that slow (I knew Atom since a few months, because I also have an eebox and I had to use it for work some time ago).
When I’m on battery I slow everything down (video brightness and CPU cycles), and for now that’s good too.
The mouse touchpad is a bit strange: I am used to that type (I have never used a thinkpad), the strange thing is that its boundaries are not so clear, but I can see that it is going to be a habit (my new Dell Studio has a very similar structure).
I see that the webcam and the mics work out of the box, and that’s always good; I had to fight a little with the wireless card, because it took a little to start working good (really don’t know why), anyway now everything seems fine… so: good buy, in my opinion!
P.S: how the hell could Asus find a _wired_ card without a driver already into the linux kernel: this must have been a very difficult search! 🙂